Epic/15mm English Civil War

[Minuteman]

[quote="steve_pickstock"]

First of all, trees. I wanted some more variation in the height of the trees I had so ordered these, cost about £8 delivered and you know what? I really like them.
They're cheap, they're not completely nasty, and without too much work they do the job. 5 of each, heights as indicated.


The other things to arrive was this church by Timeline Miniatures. They also do it in 28mm I believe.
I chose this one because a) it captures the nature of a late medieval/17thC church before the rich folk of the 18th and 19th centuries got their hands on it, showing off how rich they were by adding fancy bits all over the place.

b) It's made out of 2mm MDF and I will be able to add some details to it to make it more like some of the churches I have fought over over the last forty years.[quote]




Good-looking trees and I like the church, which should look fine once embellished and painted up.

[Minuteman]

The other things to arrive was this church by Timeline Miniatures. They also do it in 28mm I believe.

b) It's made out of 2mm MDF and I will be able to add some details to it to make it more like some of the churches I have fought over over the last forty years.

Noting your long history of fighting in churchyards (! ), did you ever see action at Alton in Hampshire? I simply ask as this was, I think, the first ECW re-enactment I saw, a re-fight in the churchyard there of the small but bloody action that took place originally in 1643 I believe?

Your anecdotes about family history, being asked to 'swap 'Knot regiments' and the 'Time Team' story are all very amusing. Thanks

[steve_pickstock]

Noting your long history of fighting in churchyards (! ), did you ever see action at Alton in Hampshire? I simply ask as this was, I think, the first ECW re-enactment I saw, a re-fight in the churchyard there of the small but bloody action that took place originally in 1643 I believe?

Your anecdotes about family history, being asked to 'swap 'Knot regiments' and the 'Time Team' story are all very amusing. Thanks

Thank you. I don't think I have ever been to Alton. Chichester, Glynde, Old Basing and Cheriton but not Alton.

I am sure I have posted the Time Team video here before - but as I am rather chuffed with it - here it is again - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o-vhynDtsHg&t=706s. It may not play in some countries, but I think it's worth it just to watch the live fire at the end.
I've done a lot of things in the SK and that's one of the best.

Anyway on with the build.
Today was mainly about getting the church together.

As mentioned, the church is quite basic, though it is a good base to work off.


When I looked at it and the parts, the first thing to deal with was that some of the actual walls were missing. I emailed the maker and they'll get me the replacements asap, but with Bank Holidays etc I reckon the earliest I will see them is Tuesday. Having said that, I looked at the doors and my thinking was this - most English churches are built on an east-west alignment and the door in the south wall is usually the main entrance/exit. The kit provides - as per the picture below - a large doorway arch (A) for the chancellry wall, a middle size doorway arch (B) for the tower doorway, and two smaller arches (C and D) for the doors in the North and South walls.


As I am glueing the roof down I don't "need" the large archway (A), so I shuffled the arches round.
The large archway (A) and the Archway (C) were used to tart up the tower doorway. This was to give it a sort of fancy Norman style doorway.


The original arch (B) from the tower went to the south door.


And the north door (D) stayed as is.


I also began to add buttresses. These are a common feature in church architecture, the ones I have done need to be filled and filed still but I also think I need to re-do the ones on the tower, as they need to be higher.

The tower goes together well, nice and square and solid, but the crenelations and the top of the tower are a bit vague. So that needed sorting out.
One of my favourite churches - St Michael and All Angels, High Ercall, has a four sided pyramid roof, so I may add one to this too.

While I was waiting for some parts to dry I made some more of the rings for the woodland features, and this image shows one of the rings on the mandrel.

They don't take long to cool once they're done, about as long as it takes to put the pen down - and it's simply a case of getting the tip of a knife underneath it and prise it free of the vinyl plate, all told I did five in about ten minutes.

Right! That's it for me today, hopefully more tomorrow. Thanks for looking.

[Minuteman]

Thanks for the reply re: Alton, Steve. No, it is not the sort of place that you might visit unless you had a good reason eg: a re-enactment. But the 'Time Team' episode is one that I will watch with interest.

Good work on the church, and the attention to detail - ie: shifting doors around etc - is a credit to your desire to get this 'looking right'...as I am sure it will in due course. Keep up the good work.

[PaulRPetri]

I am being slowly sucked into a ECW project with these minis for a big wargame convention here in the US. I love watching your progress Steve! I did the ACW already in the Epic scale and you have to rethink how to paint as you paint 10 infantry in a single strip. Took some getting used to.

kb it was The Battle of Edge hill have a watch. I love this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNiRXIxIftY&t=346s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxjyGn17Mo4&t=1s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ty7YzXapGvk

[steve_pickstock]

I am being slowly sucked into a ECW project with these minis for a big wargame convention here in the US. I love watching your progress Steve! I did the ACW already in the Epic scale and you have to rethink how to paint as you paint 10 infantry in a single strip. Took some getting used to.

kb it was The Battle of Edge hill have a watch. I love this video.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNiRXIxIftY&t=346s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxjyGn17Mo4&t=1s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ty7YzXapGvk

Excellent! And yes I have thought very carefully about how to paint these guys. I'm happy so far, but I have seen some truly inspirational work by people around the internet.

Edgehill - I have, surprisingly only 'done' Edgehill once, in 1992 which was a 350th anniversary event. Because the cavalry played such a big part in the battle, they gathered together as many Horse as they could - past members, mates, British army cavalry, and instead of the usual 12 aside there were at least 60 on the field. There were a few 'issues', where people lost it a bit, but nothing that couldn't be sorted out - by a well-trained pike block. At one point all of the Horse were brigaded together to perform the initial cavalry charge, and the sight, sound and sheer sensation of 60+ Horse thundering past is quite stunning.

The other time I was at Edgehill, was in 1982 or 3 when I was part of a group that marched across country from Worcester to Cropredy Bridge, as part of the lead-up to a battle there. We had all of our gear in a cart that my dad built and took the back roads and green lanes through the area, visiting the battle field at Edgehill, with permission from the Ministry of Defence, and staying at Ratley village on the top of the hill - where Prince Rupert had his headquarters before the battle.

I have dozens of stories from that week alone, and won't bore you with them but as we got closer to Edgehill it all got a little strange. It was August and a long hot summer, the harvest had been cut and they were burning the stubble in the fields, so that all round us, as we walked, there were plumes of smoke in the still summer air. And as we walked towards it, the escarpment at Edgehill loomed in the distance. Even in the summer sunshine it looked dark and a little brooding in the distance.
The battle was fought at the foot of the hill, on the relatively flat land that is now the M.O.D.'s Central Ammunition Depot, Kineton.
There is a burial area - known as Blood Alley - that is every bit as spooky as it it's meant to sound. There are many stories about the battlefield, from the ghost stories told by the locals after the battle, to reports of lights and strange occurrences in the guard room at the CAD.
This picture is the group pulling the cart up the steep lane that leads to the top.

[C M Dodson]

Nice memories from that picture I would imagine.

I travelled to Edgehill and was disappointed that there does not seem any attempt to recognise the action anywhere.

Naseby, apart from a monument and some boarding’s was similarly disappointing .

It is a great shame that our Nation’s history is on occasion neglected ,especially with the pressure by some these days to erase it completely.

It is the curse of man that he forgets.

Best wishes,

Chris

[steve_pickstock]

Nice memories from that picture I would imagine.

I travelled to Edgehill and was disappointed that there does not seem any attempt to recognise the action anywhere.

Naseby, apart from a monument and some boarding’s was similarly disappointing .

It is a great shame that our Nation’s history is on occasion neglected ,especially with the pressure by some these days to erase it completely.

It is the curse of man that he forgets.

Best wishes,

Chris

There is a monument at Edgehill - got a story about that, late night, a friend in kit, a dark country road, headlights - anyway, it's just down the road from the CAD, and pretty close to the battle.

Naseby has two, the one by the side of the road, and Cromwell's monument closer to Naseby village (yup! Got a story about that too).

But you're right, sadly there is a distinct lack of monumental recognition of battlefield sites, especially given how important the ECW was to the history of our country and our system of government.

[PaulRPetri]

Great stories Steve thanks for sharing!

[PaulRPetri]

Steve here is my ACW stuff I posted a bit back.
viewtopic.php?f=78&t=25412

[Minuteman]

Nice memories from that picture I would imagine.

I travelled to Edgehill and was disappointed that there does not seem any attempt to recognise the action anywhere.

Naseby, apart from a monument and some boarding’s was similarly disappointing .

It is a great shame that our Nation’s history is on occasion neglected ,especially with the pressure by some these days to erase it completely.

It is the curse of man that he forgets.

Best wishes,

Chris

Yes, I have to agree. Certainly Steve's anecdotes and stories are most entertaining.

Living as I do right next to the battlefield of the First Battle of Newbury (English Civil War, 1643), and a couple of miles from Second Newbury (1644) I am awaiting the day when new housing is proposed/starts being built on some of what are currently open farm fields.

IMHO: As interested parties, we need to remain vigilant to encroaching development on what should be preserved as 'hallowed ground'.

[steve_pickstock]

Just a quick note on progress today, and a thank you to everyone who has commented.

I'm not sure how many people grasp the significance of the Civil Wars. I mean yes, it was 380 odd years ago, but it changed our society. The events of the ECW created the Mother of All Parliaments (for better or worse), defined our monarch's role, and started the decline of the aristocracy. It left its mark on the fabric of our country in many many ways. I even knew people who would not allow Cromwell's name to be mentioned in their houses right up to just a few years ago. One of them for what the Parliamentarians did to his ancestor, and the other for his supposed crimes in Ireland. I have not been allowed in pubs because they were rebel houses, vice versa.
It is a shame that it is not recognised more, and that we spend so much time and energy on other parts of the past - which is fine, they are part of what made us as well, but we tend to just give the ECW lip service.

Anyway on with the build.

Woods - they're coming along. This last week the areas around the plastic rings were filled and smoothed. The bases were painted with a mix of craft paint Dark Ochre and some Vallejo black, which had Vallejo Green-Brow stippled over it (like the bases of the trees themselves) and finally some Vallejo Olive Green over that.

These bases are about 6" x 4" (15cm x 10cm). The 'slots' are 40mm internal diameter, to accommodate the bases of the actual trees themselves. The trees here are the smaller ones I bought off eBay, ideal for 15mm/Epic figures.



This first picture shows some of the bigger trees off eBay and one of the smaller tree bases. I think these bigger trees are probably a touch too big for the 15mm figures, and may look for some 'in between' sized models, though as they are these would do fine for my 20mm/1:72 sized armies.


The same bigger trees with one of the woodland clutter bases I made to throw in to fill more slots.


The fallen trees are twigs from a grape vine that my neighbour had that grew like a weed. It died eventually but the dry twigs are great, with lots of character and they were in my backyard so ideally placed to be used for this.

The next thing to do with the woodland bases is to green them - clump foliage, flock etc and dried and chopped Basil to simulate leaf scatter. Then a matt varnish over that.

So thanks for looking in. Enjoy this weekend's spectacle - Mrs P is baking like crazy for it. See ya.

[steve_pickstock]

Noting your long history of fighting in churchyards (! ), did you ever see action at Alton in Hampshire? I simply ask as this was, I think, the first ECW re-enactment I saw, a re-fight in the churchyard there of the small but bloody action that took place originally in 1643 I believe.

With regard to this, this photo just popped up on my Facebook feed.



It's a 28mm model of Alton church by a friend of mine. I thought you might enjoy it.

[Peter]

Really nice! Thanks for sharing this very realistic diorama!

[Minuteman]

With regard to this, this photo just popped up on my Facebook feed.



It's a 28mm model of Alton church by a friend of mine. I thought you might enjoy it.

Thanks Steve, that is an impressive model of Alton and St Lawrence's church. My compliments to your friend, the modeller of this fine scene.

The church of St Lawrence at Alton in Hampshire (southern England) has a long and interesting history. The battle of Alton in 1643 culminated with a Parliamentarian force storming the church itself, forcing the surrender of the (smaller) Royalist force and the death of its commander, Colonel Richard Boles, reputedly on the steps of the pulpit within the church itself. There is a spirited account and a picture of the church at Wikipedia, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Church_of ... nce,_Alton

The re-enactment of this English Civil War battle which I witnessed sometime in the 1970s was suitably well-staged by the Sealed Knot, with plenty of musketry and smoke, although I am pretty sure that the Vicar of St Lawrence Church did not allow access by the re-enactors to his church...meaning that the SK Royalist commander must have had to stage his glorious 'death' somewhere outside, perhaps on a friendly war memorial or at the main entrance to the church itself! All good stuff.

[C M Dodson]

Is that Anthony Webb’s work ?

It looks very similar to his 100 years war project modelling style.

Best wishes,

Chris

[steve_pickstock]

Is that Anthony Webb’s work ?

It looks very similar to his 100 years war project modelling style.

Best wishes,

Chris

It is!

I would not have posted it, it being someone else's work, but Minuteman had mentioned Alton Church earlier in the thread - and it's a nice bit of work!

[steve_pickstock]

Hope this finds you all well.

A lot of the greening done, but it did show a couple of things up.
1. The bases of the trees need a bit of work to match them to the woodland areas better, and they need the edges of the bases painting because they stand out if they're not seated properly.
2. Some of the solution I used to seal the flock down has gone white - that needs sorting out.
3. I need some more trees, of a height somewhere between the two lots that I have got already.

So first up - all four bases set up with trees and clutter bases.





This one shows the way the woodland areas are supposed to be used with a tree base set to one side so troops can be placed on the woodland area.


The individual woodland areas can be pushed together to make bigger areas.



This woodland area is set up first with the smaller type of tree - suitable for N-gauge

And here it is with the bigger trees.

So the woodland areas work with both sizes of trees, but I'm definitely shopping for another middle size of tree.

Thanks for looking in Steve.

[C M Dodson]

They look very nice indeed and ideal for visual but practical war game terrain .

The horse hair things that you see at conventions look like……. horse hair.

These are special.

Best wishes,

Chris

[steve_pickstock]

They look very nice indeed and ideal for visual but practical war game terrain .

The horse hair things that you see at conventions look like……. horse hair.

These are special.

Best wishes,

Chris

Thanks.

I like the rubberised horse hair for ground cover, Like brambles, like this from my Amon Hen build ...

... but it doesn't work in this case - it's a bit overpowering. I did think about teasing out a plastic pan scourer and painting that to get something similar, but it wasn't working for me.

As for the trees, for the price - all up the 50 trees - 40 x 5cm, 5 x 8cm, and 5 x 10cm - have only cost about £15 - I couldn't make anything as useable for that price. (incidentally you would pay that for 3 model trees in some of the local model railway shops) All the rest is scraps and bits, so those four woodland areas cost about a fiver each.

Looking at those numbers I can definitely spring for some more to get some more variation in height.