Miniatures Talk

Plastic of the Caesar Figures.

Posted by Jaques on 24 Dec 2018, 22:32

Hi , friends.

I am old collector and still paint with enamel paint.
My Caesar figures, once painted, it looks like the paint reacts with the manufacturer's plastic and it starts to get sticky as if they were melting.
Any friend know if the type of plastic used only accepts acrylic paint well?

Regards . :thumbup:
Jaques  Brazil
 
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Posted by Ochoin on 25 Dec 2018, 02:09

Jacque, this was one of the reasons I switched to Vallejo paint. I have Caesar figures painted with enamels from 7 years ago & the paint is *still* sticky.

You can try to put a clear coat of something like Dullcoat over them & this helps to a degree.

donald
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Ochoin  Scotland
 
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Posted by Bluefalchion on 25 Dec 2018, 04:15

I encountered this issue and asked about it when I first joined the forum. The correct answer is switch to acrylics, which I eventually did.

But for the short term, my Testors enamel paints had not dried 30 days after painting the Caesar figure. Modern Kiwi (I miss that dude) gave me a good tip. I coated the next figures with a 50/50 mixture of gesso and water and used that for a primer. It has a bit of a chalky texture, and, once dried, gave a nice platform for the enamel paint.

Good luck.
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Bluefalchion  United States of America
 
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Posted by Beano Boy on 25 Dec 2018, 10:47

Image YES THE DAY ARRIVED

A wide awake answer and musings. By Me

I use both types of acrylics and enamel paints, but tend to favour the old school enamel paints.
Well I paint toy soldier style. I always use a brush to undercoat not spay paints that contain thinners that can melt plastic. Along with quite a few lungs. :eh: EH!

However when using enamel paints often was the case the first undercoat applied to my figures remained rather sticky. If it remained so after two days I`d simply undercoat again in the same stuff I used before which dried up normally and dry to the touch. No conjuring trick to that it was just a fact.

I say was because painting is often beyond my means.
Not the cost but the steady exercise in general associated with it.
However I`m happy and content to see FredG`s painting style which is ongoing Napoleonic`s my favourite, and I guess his woolly sheep are acceptable too. :thumbup:

The plus of using enamel paints is there is no necessity to protect your work with two types of rather expensive tinned varnish. The main reason for doing so is the molecules in acrylic paint do not knit back together again properly when the paint is watered down. So it often will peal off especially from the flat bases.

The best primer I use is a mixture of White Enamel and Semi Matt, which I tip out into a container and stir -up, then pour them back into the cans. it takes only a couple of minutes and the result is it gives a much better paint for my use. I then mark the cans with a label Half & Half.

May you all enjoy your modelling kits and needful figures,new brushes and paints galore.
but first pick up all that colourful noisy wrapping paper. :coffee: BB
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Posted by Kekso on 25 Dec 2018, 11:27

Maybe you can change thinner for your enamel paints?
Maybe you can give your figures coat of acrylic primer and/or varnish before painting with enamels? If you don't have acrylics, try watered down PVA glue.

I'm not sure it will work, therefore I started my sentences with maybe.
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Kekso  Croatia

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Posted by zulu`s 1000`s of em on 25 Dec 2018, 21:56

Use an all plastic primer first, then you should be fine with enamels.
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Posted by Bluefalchion on 26 Dec 2018, 05:56

Ah yes, here it is. My very first post on this fine forum, almost exactly 8 years ago:

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6523&p=81113#p81113
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Bluefalchion  United States of America
 
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Posted by Wiking on 26 Dec 2018, 09:44

I read Bluefalchion`s (link) very first post eight years ago.

Bluefalchion wrote a few posts up here:
The correct answer is switch to acrylics, which I eventually did.

Yes.
This is a certificate for acrylics.

For me it was the best decision in the hobby till now to change from enamel to acrylics.
Nothing did such an impact. Not the increasing of models, figures nor the quality of it.
Because simply for each kit or figure you need paint.
And once more again:

Pro:
No more smell if you open the can.
No more smell if you open the can to clean the brush.
You need a brush cleaner who is more expensive as water.
You have to replace it by time !
Water is always available.
The opening of the bottles (most but not all acrylics) is more easy as the Revell, Humbrol cans.
Easy thinning with water. No more to open the thinner (smell) and close it.
Or your thinner who is more expensive as water will evaporate !
My water for thinning is open all the time. No smell.
You safe by using acrylics a lot of time with that. Open, close, open, close ...
With acrylics only the paint bottle is to close and they are fare more handy.

...no smell, easy, faster ...
But be in mind nothing is perfect.

Con:
It will cost a lot to get all the needed color in acrylic.
Yes, we all or most of us payed that price.
I start with some acrylic and use my enamel till the can is empty.
Yes, you can. I thought the same. And switched very, very rapid to only acrylic.
After approx.15 years I spend all the (will use till the can is empty and have never done) enamel cans in the correct dust bin.
I don`t know what brand is the best.
I read her : Andrea, MIG, Vallejo, Maribu, etc. You get a forum full of member who can help you.
The colors are not 1:1 to enamel.
Right. This is a correct argument.
All your knowledge about the base color for face, for wood, for metal and so on is now worthless.
You have to try several things new.

But finally if you will stay with enamels.
Do it.
If you are a bit negative to acrylic do not use it. You will be always unhappy with the result.

If you are unsure but not negative,
try acrylics and believe in my words
in the end the fun factor increase !

Now the circle is closed and we stay again by Bluefalchion:
The correct answer is switch to acrylics, which I eventually did.

:thumbup:
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Wiking  Germany
 
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Posted by Paul on 26 Dec 2018, 10:46

Wiking wrote:Easy thinning with water.

Add a couple of Drops of window /Floor cleaner to the water..it helps the flow of the paint. Most paints that come in those tiny expensive pots and are aimed at the Hobby* smell, to me, of Floor cleaner anyway. ;-)
Clean the brushes in pure vinegar.
Wiking wrote:Con:
It will cost a lot to get all the needed color in acrylic.
Yes, we all or most of us payed that price.

It´s really only necessary to buy half a dozen or so colours..Red, Yellow, blue, white, black, silver and Gold...and a mixing pallette..old CD´s are good for that purpose.

It´s not necessary to buy expensive* paints with named labels. Craft store paints are just as good.


*There´s only a handfull of paint producers who make the paints for craft and hobby paints. Slightly different pigment variations but not by much.
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Paul  China

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Posted by Jaques on 26 Dec 2018, 12:00

Hi , friends. :thumbup:

Thank you very much to all forum friends for the information.
I love this integration and international friendship of our forum and hobby.

Regards. :yeah:
Jaques  Brazil
 
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Posted by Santi Pérez on 26 Dec 2018, 18:49

Wiking wrote:Pro:
No more smell if you open the can.
No more smell if you open the can to clean the brush.
You need a brush cleaner who is more expensive as water.
You have to replace it by time !
Water is always available.
The opening of the bottles (most but not all acrylics) is more easy as the Revell, Humbrol cans.
Easy thinning with water. No more to open the thinner (smell) and close it.
Or your thinner who is more expensive as water will evaporate !
My water for thinning is open all the time. No smell.
You safe by using acrylics a lot of time with that. Open, close, open, close ...
With acrylics only the paint bottle is to close and they are fare more handy.

...no smell, easy, faster ...
But be in mind nothing is perfect.


Although I totally agree that nothing is perfect, I subscribe all the pros Wiking has listed. I changed to acrylics many years ago and I have never regretted it. I think the handling and results are much better than with enamels.

As Wiking says, try the acrylics, and surely you will not regret it, Jaques. ;-)

Santi.
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Santi Pérez  Spain
 
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Posted by Kekso on 27 Dec 2018, 18:38

Where's the fun if nothing smells? :xd: :xd: :xd:
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Kekso  Croatia

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Posted by Paul on 27 Dec 2018, 19:13

...said the actress to the Bishop
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Paul  China

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Posted by Rich W on 27 Dec 2018, 23:25

I've got to agree with the majority here-moving to vallejo acrylics has been a big improvement for me.
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Posted by MABO on 01 Jan 2019, 11:00

Paul wrote:...said the actress to the Bishop


I am not sure who smells more...
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Posted by MABO on 01 Jan 2019, 11:02

Rich W wrote:I've got to agree with the majority here-moving to vallejo acrylics has been a big improvement for me.


Yes I would like to underline that. :thumbup:
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MABO  Europe
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Posted by Paul on 01 Jan 2019, 11:56

MABO wrote:I am not sure who smells more...

...........said the Bishop to the actress
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Paul  China

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Posted by MABO on 02 Jan 2019, 01:13

Your point! :-D :-D :-D
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Posted by vellek on 08 Jan 2019, 23:29

Paul wrote:...said the actress to the Bishop

Just stumbled over this post and now everyone in the office is wondering why I'm laughing
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vellek  United States of America
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Posted by Marvin on 09 Jan 2019, 11:41

Okay - so, I'm a bit late with this reply but I'm now going to confuse things all over again. :mad:

You see, I use Vallejo acrylics too. I also painted some Caesar miniatures figures last year, my first time with Caesar.
http://bennosfiguresforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=21513&hilit=caesar+french

All was great, very happy with the figs, until I discovered they had gone 'sticky' some weeks after painting them too. This was the first time this had ever happened to me and I've been using acrylics for years now for many different manufacturers. I prime and paint with acrylics and use only water to clean brushes (no solvents).

I reapplied some matt varnish and the figs looked immediately much better initially but over time they have gone sticky again, though not quite as bad or covering all over the figures as before. So my long term plan is to keep adding some matt varnish (Daler Rowney acrylic matt varnish is the best in the universe if you can get hold of any!) at the risk of losing a little paint detail.

In conclusion, I think the problem must lie with Caesar's plastic at it seems to be the common factor between my and Jaques' problems? I think I'll be very wary of using Caesar in the future - though they are terrific figures 8) - though if I do any more I might try the suggestion of priming with PVA glue which has worked well for me before and would create a barrier between the figure and the paint without loss of detail if you apply it evenly and not too thickly.

I think I need coffee now... :coffee:

Best of luck with all your painting, Jaques! :thumbup:
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