Just how big are elephants?

[Ochoin]

The wildlife in Australia is plentiful & exotic but does not run to elephants.

My 2021 project is the army of Pyrrhus (in 1/72). I'm assembling an army based on HaT & Newline figures (mostly). I'm looking at war elephants.

The Hat ones:
http://www.plasticsoldierreview.com/Review.aspx?id=573
These seem very small.

The Zvesda ones:
http://www.plasticsoldierreview.com/Review.aspx?id=349
These seem very large.

The Newline ones:
https://newlinedesigns.co.uk/product-ca ... cedonians/
These seem hard to tell.

I have the two plastic ones......any comments on which of the three are the right size?

donald

[sberry]

Yeah, elephant size in 1/72 scenarios is an old problem for which I also have no perfect answer/solution. But let's try:
The Zvezda ones are in fact really big; I suppose they are meant to represent Indian elephants.
The ones made by HäT are dwarves in comparison. But they represent Carthaginian war elephants, and there is some speculation that Carthage might have used the African forest elephant, which is quite small compared to the other species in Africa, the African bush elephant, or their Indian cousin.
I have to admit that I do not know where Pyrrhus got his beasts from...

[Konrad]

How about this one?
SPEIRA MINIATURES

[Wiking]

I think so an elephant is quite big.

Call him Ferdinand.

[Ochoin]

I think so an elephant is quite big.

Call him Ferdinand.

What a ridiculous beast! The size of his trunk is outrageous!! And he has no ears!!!

donald

[Emperor]

Elephant is an great animal...I once gave peanut to one in Zoo back in school...

[Pocho Azul]

My impression is that no-one really knows what species of elephant Pyrrhic armies used, or how exactly how big they really were. I recommend you get the ones that look the coolest.

[sberry]

I recommend you get the ones that look the coolest.

I suppose that's the best advice that is possible on this topic.

[Emperor]

Interesting the African elephant has his ears in shape of African continet, and an Indian elephant has his ears in shape of Indian sub/continent...

[Ochoin]

Interesting the African elephant has his ears in shape of African continet, and an Indian elephant has his ears in shape of Indian sub/continent...

Finland looks like a rabbit.

https://www.britannica.com/place/Finland

(I was told this by a Finn).

donald

[Ochoin]

I suppose that's the best advice that is possible on this topic.

Zvesda it is, then.

donald

[Emperor]

If there is no infos like frescos or something from that time, you can do it as you wish...

[sberry]

Have you ever considered to use the set HäT 8142 Indian Elephant? They come without towers, but are comparable to the Zvezda ones in size and give some more variation.
I have used them in 2011 for an Asculum scenario, using the towers from the smaller HäT Carthaginian ones for some conversions:

[Beano Boy]

Reminded me of,' heffalumps and woozles.' BB

[Santi Pérez]

Wow, what a fantastic diorama that of the Asculum scenario, sberry!

I love specially two details. The Roman legionary caught by the elephant's trunk:



And the two-story wagon:



Santi.

[Wiking]

Ochion wrote:
And he has no ears!!!

Oh, My mistake. A discussion about Elephants WITH ears.

Now, here is my second try:

[Ochoin]

Thank you for kindly supplying the photo.

I have found that there is a variety of elephant-sizes possible. These are a result of age, species but also individual differences.

Like us, elephants come in a range: big & small & the differences can be quite siginificant. Even several feet of difference.

eg The biggest Indian elephant known: "Raja Gaj stood 3.43 m (11.3 ft) tall at the shoulder and had a massive body weight. His forehead and domes were more prominent than in other Asian bull elephants. His appearance has been compared to that of a Stegodon and mammoth due to his high bi-domed shaped head." African Bush elephants reach an average of 3.2 metres.

The model you show seems to be a smallish Indian one: a bit over 2 metres tall?

So, I'm not going to get hung up by differences in models. Zvesda it is!

donald

[Wiking]

Ochion wrote:
The model you show seems to be a smallish Indian one: a bit over 2 metres tall?

Puh! well observed !
It is from CMK and for the (RAF) Indian theater.

[carlosfaro]

Interesting biological-zoological-hidtoricsl-geografical discussion.

I would say Phyrrus had Asian ellies supplied though Seleucid empire. But maybe not, and they came from tolemaic egypt and were small North African versión..

Lets us bring some archeological pics just for more fun..

This articule about coins is great (you Will find Lots of Ancient Kings or generales and their different probable elephants), and there is even some evidence about Phirrus Asian ellies un some ingots.

Source: https://coinweek.com/ancient-coins/elep ... ent-coins/

[Howlin]

I have a thing for collecting the ancient elephants series, so I thought this might help, to see them all together, rated for size.... Its something I would have liked to have. (thank you for plasticsoliderreview for helping me with my collection!) I think afterwards of taking pictures I might rank the HAT Indian elephant (I really like this one, other than the super soft plastic) as larger than the Linear-a versions. They are a little longer but the Indian one is slightly taller and wider. They all look reasonably well together in my mind, accept for the HAT war elephants that seem to be a slightly smaller scale. Even the warriors look puny when compared to other makers, and even Vs. other sets HAT has made. (I also had trouble getting both tower riders to fit in, as there are peg molds that hold the towers together). The lucky toys elephant at the end is missing part of its trunk but is the largest (I will likely make this instead of use the stock part), it is really long and tall, and pose is rather static. The Zvezda elephant with the raised leg is almost the largest and looks really big due to its position raising up. If I had a LW elephant it would likely dwarf all of them. I have never seen one of those for sale, but I figure I am not missing out. The linear A versions had a little more trimming to do that the others (the HAT war elephants have a distinct mold line too) and this plastic they use is a pain to trim, its like a hard taffy, and creates little hairs when trying to cut off, but they are beautiful.

There are no wrong choices but overall the Zvezda still make the best appearance and are a good plastic and well molded. The only down side is the long spear has that coupling.







And here is the real showing of the differences in size, I am not sure trying to say they are different species even comes close but I am not a zoologist. This is my Zvezda custom, to a flail elephant.