Miniatures Talk

Medieval troops mid 14th Century

Posted by Traveller1865 on 13 Dec 2017, 20:05

Great links Paul, explains it very well though the Caesar 15th century knights I just ordered might not be entirely correct for my 1361 date but not really a problem in this scale, they have some shining armor that's what counts. Really looking forward to painting medieval figs again.
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Posted by Susofrick on 14 Dec 2017, 09:21

1361 ... hmm, if I am correct it is a very nice town during Summer, but not so nice during the colder seasons. Made a scene from there once. Phew. :sweatdrop: Took a while to find it. http://www.valdemarminiatureforum.com/t899f6-One-sunny-afternoon-on-Gotland.html
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 14 Dec 2017, 12:48

Nice one, and same figures I plan to use for civilian onlookers. Btw were the upper part of the walls like that in 1361? Sometimes the wall is depicted as it is today.
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Posted by Susofrick on 14 Dec 2017, 14:15

Have no idea how the walls looked in 1361. 1986 I know for certain. :-) The wall is from Valdemar's Castle, the back of the stable. All I have and I thought it could be nice to use it like this. I think your best option is to make them like today, just not as much ruined. ;-) Think some of Nikolai's civilians could look nice there too.
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 14 Dec 2017, 15:19

Well I need to research some more it seems. Nikolai figures look great but that worries me, that they are actually much larger than most 1/72 figures.
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Posted by Paul on 14 Dec 2017, 17:22

Ah ha!! VIsby! Ok..then you can go a bit wider with your choices for sets. The Gutnish army were mainly yeomen /militia and used older types of armour than plate, in fact, full plate wasn´t so common at all.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IGY2OqMXF9w&t=288s
Poorly equipped (chain and a coat of plates) and trained, Against Valdemars army, who wore better transitional lamellar armour the poor buggers had no chance
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 14 Dec 2017, 17:45

Yes I've been a bit secretive about my next epic diorama project, anyway what about full shabraques on horses? I ordered the Emhar Crested knight set, seems like one character could be Valdemar himself or some commander and a couple of mounted standard bearers. Reenactments seem to portray horses without them, I could find new horses for the figures though. I saw your work on them Paul btw looks good.

For Gutnish army I plan to use the lightly armed figures from the Zvezda English and French 100 years war sets, the crossbowmen for Valdemar's Danes and German mercenaries, archers for the poor Guts.
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Posted by Susofrick on 15 Dec 2017, 09:07

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Posted by Traveller1865 on 15 Dec 2017, 11:02

Great links, found out how the wall probably appeared in 1361:

Image

Image

This will be difficult, but not impossible. will have to modify the Miniart castle model.. Those wooden magazines on top might be done in some 3d Printing I hope..Any suggestions for who could make the magazines are very welcome.
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Posted by Paul on 15 Dec 2017, 16:02

Traveller1865 wrote: anyway what about full shabraques on horses? .

By full shabraques do you mean Caparisons?

The Castle. It doesn´t look too complicated and shouldn´t be too much to re-create by scratchbuilding ?
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 15 Dec 2017, 16:34

Paul wrote:By full shabraques do you mean Caparisons?

The Castle. It doesn´t look too complicated and shouldn´t be too much to re-create by scratchbuilding ?


Yes I meant caparisons, seems google translates it to shabraque, maybe theres no Swedish word for it. Yes scratchbuilding shouldn't be a problem, its just Im very busy most of the time though could be a summer project.
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Posted by Paul on 15 Dec 2017, 17:35

Caparisons were in use since the 12th Century and into the early renaissance
so definately also in the mid 14th Cent
http://www.larsdatter.com/caparisons.htm
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 15 Dec 2017, 20:29

Great, I'm obviously no expert, somehow I thought they were rarely used in battle. It's not known if horses were with Valdemar and his troops but surely Valdemar and his closest would have been mounted.
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Posted by Paul on 16 Dec 2017, 10:23

Theyéd have definately have nags with but seeing as the majority of battles were fought on foot , nags being either used for a massive Impact Charge or chasing the fleeing enemy (niether case at visby) they would have been Held in the rear. Didn´t they rip down part of the walls to ride into the City? If so then they definately had nags.
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 16 Dec 2017, 10:46

Nothing is known of the actual battle, if there were any official information it was probably stored in an archive that burnt down in the late 17th century. They didn't tear down the wall, the city people who watched the battle managed a deal with Valdemar and paid some taxes while Valdemar's troops plundered the countryside.

I plan to have Valdemar and his entourage in the rear, that Emhar set is really impressive.
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Posted by Susofrick on 19 Dec 2017, 15:29

Found three old books in the hobbyroom, one from 1924 with black-and-white photos, one from 1939 with water colour paintings, and one from 1982 with just text. The problem is the walls look just like when I was there 1986.

Image

Are there any figures you need I can check the collection.
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 19 Dec 2017, 20:04

Well I suspect it did look like that model, in some paintings artists have used a different look like this:
Image

Going to read a book I just received if there's more info on the general appearance.
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 19 Dec 2017, 21:10

Apparantly there were too deep moats in front of the wall, not waterfilled. The sources I have all suggest the appearance like that of the model. There was a wooden platform that the citizens of Visby would have stood on watching the battle. Difficult stuff here but not impossible.
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 28 Dec 2017, 17:13

Well some of the Gutnish peasant militia have arrived, courtesy of Tumbling Dice, not the best figures but can be used for other periods where peasants were involved in struggle like the German Peasants War etc. Some assembly with a variety of peasant tools which is interesting, these poor peasants had no chance against the trained mercenary forces of Valdemar.

Image

Image

Image
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Posted by Traveller1865 on 03 Jan 2018, 21:41

Need help, the wall was/is 11 metres high, how tall is that in 1/72 scale?
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