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Ancient Pre- 400B.C. non-torsion missile thrower/ catapult

Posted by Howlin on 24 Sep 2021, 07:28

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Adapted design from the Missile launcher in above picture, with other designs that show multiple arrows in smaller machines.


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Howlin  United States of America
 
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Posted by Ochoin on 24 Sep 2021, 08:26

Hilarious!

Rube Goldberg could have designed this.

Your construction is, of course, impeccable.

donald
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Ochoin  Scotland
 
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Posted by Minuteman on 24 Sep 2021, 09:12

That is a formidable war-engine!
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Posted by Howlin on 24 Sep 2021, 16:48

I had to find the reference 9rube Goldberg devises), his work is emulated often, but the name eluded me. Thanks!

It is a little funny in how it all works, and if the men could even lift a missile that high, but with a little imagination, we can suspend total reality for a moment.

Realistically would have to be used like musket lines with dozens of machines like this, and just all fire at the same time


Its a short range multi shot. The large missile is an accurate shot, and the head is designed to break off in the dirt so the stick part can then kick around. The 3 shots don't have top n bottom quills so they kinda randomly arc to the sides. Good for anti elephants, ships?
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Posted by Wiking on 24 Sep 2021, 16:58

Today we call the four flying things from down to top.

ESA Rocket
ROSKOSMOS Rocket
NASA Rocket

SPACE X, Super heavy ...

:-D
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Wiking  Germany
 
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Posted by Howlin on 24 Sep 2021, 20:18

ya know, it kinda does look like a space X rocket!
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Posted by PhilC on 24 Sep 2021, 23:13

Incredible war machine, I've never seen anything like this, quite surprising.
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PhilC  Europe

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Posted by Michael Robert on 25 Sep 2021, 14:28

Hi Howlin
Where did you dig up these? I cannot see how this missile launcher is supposed to work. Can u describe further?
Hilarious it is, true
Greetings
Michael
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Michael Robert  France

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Posted by Howlin on 26 Sep 2021, 04:10

Lots of deep dive searches for pictures like with tags like "siege machine, Ancient Ballista, catapult, and Roman Siege, Castle defense, war elephant, Elephant chariot, scyth chariot etc... and combinations of such words. Mostly through Bing. But lately have seen the value in Alamy even though some images can't be saved. But the nice thing about them is they source the images and many come from old medieval manuscripts. And I love the quirky variety, I want to do a mobile version too, I have a few other similar source photos, and another is like a 9 shot "organ gun" for arrows....


This is like base ball, a springy board is bent and released and batters up! Knocks it out of the park, Down sides is I Image a lot of snapped springs, short life span of the springs and torsion would just be more efficient, in that the potential energy stored in the machine brings the projectile to speed "gradually", while this design transfers the full potential energy of the spring in inertia in one moment.
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Posted by Michael Robert on 26 Sep 2021, 17:55

Thanks for your explanations, Howlin
Just you, can't imagine how you are supposed to hit a target with such a kind of whiplash. Probably, it is just theory or was abandoned after the very first prototype
Michael
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Michael Robert  France

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Posted by Howlin on 26 Sep 2021, 18:17

I'm sure these were pretty dangerous, especially my big design, but I have seen too many images to think it was a failed prototype. If that were the case I doubt much would have survived. Its not much different than a big bow with one arm.

I do not think the major recoil, whiplash effect will act much on the projectile, since it will be on its way flying moments before the plank hits the rest. Its really like a well calibrated golf swing.

My design I made much simpler without an elevation aimer (i missed that part thinking it was like the bottom cart version), or rotating base.


not sure what they are using for a spring in these mobile ones. Maybe a giant coil spring.



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This type uses torsion springs but same principle




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Siege of Syracuse, approx 400B.C. look behind the first engine.



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this is one I may make sometime.... 9 arrows!



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Posted by Michael Robert on 26 Sep 2021, 18:44

Howlin
You start to convince me. True, they were as intelligent in those days as we today. Never underestimate.
I try to imagine the effect and the particular interest of this engine. To me a dart only makes sens when you can aim properly. Must be somewhere along this
Very interesting
Thank you
Michael
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Posted by Xantippos on 08 Oct 2021, 14:51

Very cool! I also saw this image and was thinking to do something similar, but didn't have the time. I applied the same concept to a Hwacha, but just for practical uses, which I need to take a picture of.

What material did you use? looks great. I have saved the image, I might do my version once I get back into ancients!
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Posted by OwenChpw on 09 Oct 2021, 09:35

I have not seen a model like this, I love the imagination in tackling such a project! Hope to see more soon!
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OwenChpw  Australia
 
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Posted by Howlin on 10 Oct 2021, 01:06

@Xantippos Thank you

I used Polystyrene plastic from Evergreen, some model trees and a few stairs from a trireme model.

Its really nice material to work with. Evergreen glues up very quickly (I use the non toxic stuff) and can be sanded for wood texture. It will look a little different once painted and those details can be seen.

its pretty easy to carve and bend too, but seems a little less dense than injection model plastic. but they all work fine together.

Not sure what a Hwacha is so will be interested to see what it is... I think you helped inspire this one too

I love the ancient quirky odd stuff.


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Posted by Howlin on 10 Oct 2021, 01:10

@OwenChpw

Thank you

I got some ideas.... but I also need to finish some first! Been a busy end of summer/ fall.

Lots of inspiration for India too they have a lot of unique war machines and elephant configurations.
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Posted by Howlin on 10 Oct 2021, 01:15

I just noticed in the top picture, there is a man in a chariot chasing another two horsemen, but they are all supported on top of a testudo! I had seen in a documentary a group of reinactors doing something similar, but I wonder if there were stories of big shows of strength or dueling combat like this?
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Posted by Xantippos on 10 Oct 2021, 15:10

It's commonly known as a medieval rocket launcher;

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As with most medieval siege weapons, there can be quite a bit of scope, and some are very small while others are quite big.

The european version is called a ribault, although that you can buy in the Zvezda set, without need to scratch build :) .
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